Posting Freak
Posts: 4,302
Threads: 256
Joined: 2008-07
Gender: Male
Level: 251
2008-12-21, 04:43 PM
(This post was last modified: 2009-02-21, 10:00 PM by Russt.)
Somewhat similar to my Archer/Slinger %DPS Comparison. But because of the sheer amount of data involved, I'm presenting all the results here in one three massive charts.
Disclaimer: I don't claim that these calculations are perfect. There are many different factors that can make a %DPS number inaccurate, including but not limited to KB, positioning, timing, overkill, uncertainties with spamming delays, etc.
Also... it's quite messy as of now. Any suggestions as to how I could better sort/present this info are greatly appreciated. If there's anything else I forgot or something you'd like to see up here, feel free to point that out as well.
Once again, this will be color coded:
KMS only
4th job
3rd job
2nd job
1st job
Skill speeds are as stated in LazyBui's Attack Speed Reference, at Fast (5) in 1st job, Faster (3) in 2nd and 3rd, and Faster (2) in 4th. Energy Drain is assumed as 450ms ->420ms and Energy Blast at 1050ms 720ms cast, 1050ms delay until further notice. Energy Orb is omitted due to lack of information being added and assumed at 960ms.
KMS only: Blast's delay assumed as 720ms (i.e. no extra delay). Transform and non-Transform skills mixed. Barrage and Dragon Strike new delays not implemented (don't know the numbers).
Maxed Stun Mastery is assumed at 3rd job and above.
(SE stun) indicates maxed Sharp Eyes buff.
Best viewed with default skin, or the colors may be a little hard to see.
All results are rounded to the nearest percent.
Credits to Fiel for his Pirate/4th job Skill Tables, LazyBui for his Attack Speed Reference, and several Marauders/Buccaneers for their helpful YouTube videos.
Posting Freak
Posts: 4,380
Threads: 186
Joined: 2008-07
Gender: Male
IGN: Volte
Level: XX
Job: Nuke
Guild: US Navy
very interesting chart. I'll definently use this when i'm doing my 4th job build
wow @ pure energy drain damage. 800%. can't wait til it's maxed 
Posting Freak
Posts: 18,970
Threads: 319
Joined: 2008-07
Organization suggestion: List the "strongest" combos for each job advancement. Probably wouldn't have to do 1st job though, since that's extremely straightforward. >_>
Posting Freak
Posts: 4,302
Threads: 256
Joined: 2008-07
Gender: Male
Level: 251
2008-12-21, 05:23 PM
(This post was last modified: 2008-12-21, 05:25 PM by Russt.)
DrRusty Wrote:I'll definently use this when i'm doing my 4th job build -reiterates the disclaimer-
Sure, it may be useful to get a general idea, but %DPS isn't everything. Even taking half a second to reposition yourself between attacks throws it off pretty wildly.
Just as an example, consider Snatch + Demolition vs Double Uppercut + Barrage. The first combo is more effective than its %DPS states because both Snatch and Demolition have a longer range, and Snatch pulls monsters toward you.
Posting Freak
Posts: 18,970
Threads: 319
Joined: 2008-07
Russt Wrote:-reiterates the disclaimer-
Sure, it may be useful to get a general idea, but %DPS isn't everything. Even taking half a second to reposition yourself between attacks throws it off pretty wildly.
Just as an example, consider Snatch + Demolition vs Double Uppercut + Barrage. The first combo is more effective than its %DPS states because both Snatch and Demolition have a longer range, and Snatch pulls monsters toward you.
Mob attack vs single target attack?
:f6:
Posting Freak
Posts: 4,302
Threads: 256
Joined: 2008-07
Gender: Male
Level: 251
2008-12-21, 05:31 PM
(This post was last modified: 2008-12-21, 05:42 PM by Russt.)
Takebacker Wrote:Mob attack vs single target attack?
:f6: But that would take two charts ._.
Maybe...
Edit: Done.
Posting Freak
Posts: 7,488
Threads: 76
Joined: 2008-07
Gender: Male
Sexual Orientation: Straight
Country Flag: North_Carolina
IGN: I don't play MS
2008-12-21, 07:07 PM
(This post was last modified: 2008-12-21, 07:12 PM by Dusk.)
*confused about how Barrage+DU outdamages Barrage+DS*
Doesn't DS do more damage (disregarding the fact that it's a mob skill) than DU, and take less time?
Edit: Well, doesn't it do 850% rather than 580% for slightly more time, anyway?
Edit2: I'm talking about single target, no stun, by the way. Or do all the combos that don't include (SE stun) include regular stun?
Edit3: A better question is, what is the best combo for untransformed and transformed Buccaneers at bosses? >_<
Posting Freak
Posts: 4,380
Threads: 186
Joined: 2008-07
Gender: Male
IGN: Volte
Level: XX
Job: Nuke
Guild: US Navy
Dusk Wrote:*confused about how Barrage+DU outdamages Barrage+DS*
Doesn't DS do more damage (disregarding the fact that it's a mob skill) than DU, and take less time?
Edit: Well, doesn't it do 850% rather than 580% for slightly more time, anyway?
Edit2: I'm talking about single target, no stun, by the way. Or do all the combos that don't include (SE stun) include regular stun?
Edit3: A better question is, what is the best combo for untransformed and transformed Buccaneers at bosses? >_<
i'm going to guess that the attacks go in the order that they are listed. Since the attacks are on a snail, it's going to stun, and the stun from double upper is going to make the barrage critical.
Posting Freak
Posts: 4,302
Threads: 256
Joined: 2008-07
Gender: Male
Level: 251
Dusk Wrote:*confused about how Barrage+DU outdamages Barrage+DS*
Doesn't DS do more damage (disregarding the fact that it's a mob skill) than DU, and take less time?
Edit: Well, doesn't it do 850% rather than 580% for slightly more time, anyway?
Edit2: I'm talking about single target, no stun, by the way. Or do all the combos that don't include (SE stun) include regular stun?
Edit3: A better question is, what is the best combo for untransformed and transformed Buccaneers at bosses? >_< Oh yeah, they all include regular stun. "Stun Mastery is assumed"
Originally I had a few entries that included (no stun), but I took them out and now I don't remember why.
Senior Member
Posts: 442
Threads: 20
Joined: 2008-08
2008-12-21, 08:39 PM
(This post was last modified: 2008-12-21, 08:44 PM by Sivrat.)
you have energy drain in 3rd job skills as 800%, and in 4th job skills as 852%. Am i missing something?
Edit : Also, care to include one more addition, it should be hard to figure out, but i'd llike to see Snatch + Shockwave (21) next to snatch + shockwave 30, just to see how much damage i would lose if i left shockwave at 21 and maxed drain, I think its 500%, because thats difference between SW (30) and SW(21) that are already listed, but just to be sure. Cuz that seems like a lot of damage to lose during ST
Posting Freak
Posts: 7,488
Threads: 76
Joined: 2008-07
Gender: Male
Sexual Orientation: Straight
Country Flag: North_Carolina
IGN: I don't play MS
Sivrat Wrote:you have energy drain in 3rd job skills as 800%, and in 4th job skills as 852%. Am i missing something?
Edit : Also, care to include one more addition, it should be hard to figure out, but i'd llike to see Snatch + Shockwave (21) next to snatch + shockwave 30, just to see how much damage i would lose if i left shockwave at 21 and maxed drain, I think its 500%, because thats difference between SW (30) and SW(21) that are already listed, but just to be sure. Cuz that seems like a lot of damage to lose during ST
Probably Speed Infusion.
Posting Freak
Posts: 4,302
Threads: 256
Joined: 2008-07
Gender: Male
Level: 251
2008-12-21, 09:14 PM
(This post was last modified: 2008-12-21, 09:26 PM by Russt.)
Yes, it's Speed Infusion. I was going to list repeats of the other skills with SI too, but it ended up being too complicated with spamming delays and such so I just left Drain there.
I'll have Snatch 30 + Shockwave 21 up in a moment.
Edit: Done.
Posting Freak
Posts: 18,970
Threads: 319
Joined: 2008-07
Bahahahaha. You only lose 300% DPS between snatch 30 + shockwave 30 and snatch 30 + shockwave 21.
I'd loooove to see some srs DPS stuff with orb.
Posting Freak
Posts: 4,302
Threads: 256
Joined: 2008-07
Gender: Male
Level: 251
300% DPS really isn't that little O_O
As for Orb, I haven't yet seen any hits per minute numbers with it, or even any vids featuring it. I could do an unofficial one though...
Wildly guessing that it can be spammed at 1200ms:
| Skill Name | 1 mob | 2 mob | 3 mob | 4 mob | 5 mob | 6 mob | | Barrage 30 + Energy Orb 30 | 988% | 1127% | 1196% | 1231% | 1248% | 1257% | | Energy Orb 30 | 750% | 1125% | 1313% | 1406% | 1453% | 1477% |
Posting Freak
Posts: 18,970
Threads: 319
Joined: 2008-07
Russt Wrote:300% DPS really isn't that little O_O
As for Orb, I haven't yet seen any hits per minute numbers with it, or even any vids featuring it. I could do an unofficial one though...
Wildly guessing that it can be spammed at 1200ms:
| Skill Name | 1 mob | 2 mob | 3 mob | 4 mob | 5 mob | 6 mob | | Barrage 30 + Energy Orb 30 | 988% | 1127% | 1196% | 1231% | 1248% | 1257% | | Energy Orb 30 | 750% | 1125% | 1313% | 1406% | 1453% | 1477% |
300 is much better than the difference between just SW 21 and 30.  Not that i'll be transformed that much at all to care about it much. :/
Like i said before though, should really hit up justin for shots per minute numbers. >_>
Posting Freak
Posts: 4,302
Threads: 256
Joined: 2008-07
Gender: Male
Level: 251
Yeah.
(Bui can't because Energy Charge isn't functional on PSes, btw.)
On a sidenote, Snatch by itself seems to be better than Shockwave. I'm not sure whether Bui's spam time on that is correct, though.
Posting Freak
Posts: 18,970
Threads: 319
Joined: 2008-07
Russt Wrote:Yeah.
(Bui can't because Energy Charge isn't functional on PSes, btw.)
On a sidenote, Snatch by itself seems to be better than Shockwave. I'm not sure whether Bui's spam time on that is correct, though.
I figured, since i know he would have done it already.
Well if you have shockwave 21, sure snatch would be better. o.o Higher % damage and stun. Isn't it a bit slower than DS? I don't remember.
Senior Member
Posts: 442
Threads: 20
Joined: 2008-08
can you spam snatch? i assumed there was delay, hence snatch + sw combo.
Member
Posts: 124
Threads: 9
Joined: 2008-08
What about pure energy blow/blast?
Posting Freak
Posts: 4,302
Threads: 256
Joined: 2008-07
Gender: Male
Level: 251
Sivrat Wrote:can you spam snatch? i assumed there was delay, hence snatch + sw combo. Yes there's a delay, but I don't know how long. For the value LazyBui has in his thread, it can still be performed faster than spamming Shockwave, but I'm not sure how correct that is.
|
