2010-02-02, 06:01 PM
Well, I tipped my hand in the third Legendary Class thread that I was approaching clear and conclusive evidence that Evans not only have a negligibly higher amount of DPS/DPM but that they may actually have a lower DPS than their A/M more specifically F/P counterparts. I had pondered making the exact same thread to disseminate my findings but was waiting for a dedicated Evan forum to do so, however you made the thread and requested the information so Evan-lovers everywhere, get ready to rip apart my work to prove me wrong, please, I really hope I'm wrong somewhere here.
I'll start off by using Russt's calculations for the Magical DPS as posted in a different thread.
I'll adjust the speeds in the calculations for Boostered values, keep in mind that I don't actually have actual data for Evan's level 3 Booster so I will have to estimate those values, however suffice it to say the values will be a little bit on the generous (faster) side. I used the I/L's TS (at base speed 1.32) for Blaze and the F/P's Slow (8) Explosion (at base speed 1.92) for Illusion for basic trending on how the Evan's skills at similar base speed might be Boostered. As you can see, here is an opportunity for my argument to fall apart, if anyone has actual speed data for these Evan skills I'd greatly appreciate it.
Paralyze: (1.54 + M*0.002) * 240 / 0.72 * 1.25 * 1.5 = 962.5 + 1.25M
Chain Lightning: (1.54 + M*0.002) * 210 / 0.69 * 1.25 * 1.5 = 878.80 + 1.141M
Blaze: (1.81 + M*0.002) * 330 / 1.05 * 1.25 * 1.15 * 1.35 * 1.1 = 1214.33 + 1.342M
Illusion: (1.81 + M*0.002) * 520 / 1.74 * 1.15 * 1.35 * 1.1 = 923.76 + 1.021M
So with these hypothetically optimistic values for speed both Blaze and Illusion don't look as bad as they did against their A/M counterparts in fact Blaze looks much stronger and under the proper conditions Illusion can take on a Paralyze. Critical Magic dictates a 1.15 multiplier on Blaze because for all intensive purposes, it is a one-hit skill, however Illusion is a four-hit skill so some reason in the back of my head I feel that the multiplier should be more, but that's beside the point and just an idea I wanted to float.
But what I am sure everyone was actually waiting for was the A/M equalizer, these numbers certainly don't support the insanity about Evan DPM being negligibly higher compared to A/M, so what is it?
SUMMONS!
I have never seen these included in any calculations or mentioned anywhere else in the many comparisons we have floating around these forums, if I missed you, I'll credit you, but lets get down to business.
Elquines: (1.54 + M*0.002) * 270 / 2.50 * 1.5 = 249.48 + 0.324M
Ifrit: (1.54 + M*0.002) * 330 / 2.50 * 1.5 = 304.92 + 0.396M
As you can tell by the numbers, I used a 2.5 second attack speed based upon experimental data I collected, however I observed that the duration between attacks can go as high as 3-ish seconds so you have some uncertainty there, but since I hypothesized the Evan's level 3 booster optimistically I did the same for the attack speeds of the summons. And now...the results.
F/P AM (962.5 + 1.25M) + (249.48 + 0.324M) = 1211.98 + 1.574M
I/L AM (878.80 + 1.141M) + (304.92 + 0.396M) = 1183.72 + 1.537M
Blaze: 1214.33 + 1.342M
Illusion: 923.76 + 1.021M
Mind blowing right? While all of my calculation should be correct, in reality all of them should have some sort of +/- given the liberties I had with estimating various values for attack speed. So, here it is, some numbers. I humbly ask that you go through these values, scrutinize them, poke holes in my ideas, fault my methods, find your own numbers, perform your own calculations, do anything to prove me wrong because I desperately want to be incorrect.
While I am happy that I mathed this out and I discovered something that changes notions about the relationship between Evan and A/M, I cannot help but fall into a bit of a gloom given this data. I am a magicphilic individual, I will continue to play mages, but in recent months I also became a huge fan of the Evan and to see my hopes crushed with my own data is difficult to say the least. On the positive front, my I/L isn't as far back compared to F/P as I initially thought. But one thing is clear, with AMs having exponentially better training and similar if not better single-target damage only one conclusion can be drawn...Evans need rebalancing.
Credits: The Attack Speed Reference found here at SP
Russt's calculations and equations taken from a post here
I'll start off by using Russt's calculations for the Magical DPS as posted in a different thread.
Russt Wrote:Paralyze: 240 BA, 0.8 sec, S element (1.25x)
Chain Lightning: 210 BA, 0.78 sec, L element (1.25x)
AM Amp: 1.50x damage
60% mastery (1.54x weighted modifier, or 'W')
Blaze: 330 BA, 1.32 sec, F element (1.25x)
Illusion: 520 BA, 2.01 sec, no element
Critical Magic: 30% chance of 1.5x damage (1.15x)
Evan Amp: 1.35x damage
Dragon Fury: 1.1x damage
Magic Mastery: 90% mastery (1.81x weighted modifier, or 'W')
Magic DPS formula, with constant factors removed: (W + M*0.002) * BA / time * modifiers
Paralyze: (1.54 + M*0.002) * 240 / 0.8 * 1.25 * 1.5 = 866.25 + 1.125M
Chain Lightning: (1.54 + M*0.002) * 210 / 0.78 * 1.25 * 1.5 = 757.97 + 0.984M
Blaze: (1.81 + M*0.002) * 330 / 1.32 * 1.25 * 1.15 * 1.35 * 1.1 = 965.95 + 1.067M
Illusion: (1.81 + M*0.002) * 520 / 2.01 * 1.15 * 1.35 * 1.1 = 799.67 + 0.884M
In general: Blaze >~ Paralyze > Chain Lightning >~ Illusion
However, this shifts slightly when magic attack is changed. In particular, Paralyze becomes stronger than Blaze if M is greater than approximately 1720, and Chain Lightning becomes stronger than Blaze if M is greater than approximately 2510. Illusion becomes stronger than Chain Lightning if M is less than approximately 420.
Also note that the +35 magic attack from Evan passives is not taken into account. This could produce a 3-6% difference for the Evan's advantage.
I'll adjust the speeds in the calculations for Boostered values, keep in mind that I don't actually have actual data for Evan's level 3 Booster so I will have to estimate those values, however suffice it to say the values will be a little bit on the generous (faster) side. I used the I/L's TS (at base speed 1.32) for Blaze and the F/P's Slow (8) Explosion (at base speed 1.92) for Illusion for basic trending on how the Evan's skills at similar base speed might be Boostered. As you can see, here is an opportunity for my argument to fall apart, if anyone has actual speed data for these Evan skills I'd greatly appreciate it.
Paralyze: (1.54 + M*0.002) * 240 / 0.72 * 1.25 * 1.5 = 962.5 + 1.25M
Chain Lightning: (1.54 + M*0.002) * 210 / 0.69 * 1.25 * 1.5 = 878.80 + 1.141M
Blaze: (1.81 + M*0.002) * 330 / 1.05 * 1.25 * 1.15 * 1.35 * 1.1 = 1214.33 + 1.342M
Illusion: (1.81 + M*0.002) * 520 / 1.74 * 1.15 * 1.35 * 1.1 = 923.76 + 1.021M
So with these hypothetically optimistic values for speed both Blaze and Illusion don't look as bad as they did against their A/M counterparts in fact Blaze looks much stronger and under the proper conditions Illusion can take on a Paralyze. Critical Magic dictates a 1.15 multiplier on Blaze because for all intensive purposes, it is a one-hit skill, however Illusion is a four-hit skill so some reason in the back of my head I feel that the multiplier should be more, but that's beside the point and just an idea I wanted to float.
But what I am sure everyone was actually waiting for was the A/M equalizer, these numbers certainly don't support the insanity about Evan DPM being negligibly higher compared to A/M, so what is it?
SUMMONS!
I have never seen these included in any calculations or mentioned anywhere else in the many comparisons we have floating around these forums, if I missed you, I'll credit you, but lets get down to business.
Elquines: (1.54 + M*0.002) * 270 / 2.50 * 1.5 = 249.48 + 0.324M
Ifrit: (1.54 + M*0.002) * 330 / 2.50 * 1.5 = 304.92 + 0.396M
As you can tell by the numbers, I used a 2.5 second attack speed based upon experimental data I collected, however I observed that the duration between attacks can go as high as 3-ish seconds so you have some uncertainty there, but since I hypothesized the Evan's level 3 booster optimistically I did the same for the attack speeds of the summons. And now...the results.
F/P AM (962.5 + 1.25M) + (249.48 + 0.324M) = 1211.98 + 1.574M
I/L AM (878.80 + 1.141M) + (304.92 + 0.396M) = 1183.72 + 1.537M
Blaze: 1214.33 + 1.342M
Illusion: 923.76 + 1.021M
Mind blowing right? While all of my calculation should be correct, in reality all of them should have some sort of +/- given the liberties I had with estimating various values for attack speed. So, here it is, some numbers. I humbly ask that you go through these values, scrutinize them, poke holes in my ideas, fault my methods, find your own numbers, perform your own calculations, do anything to prove me wrong because I desperately want to be incorrect.
While I am happy that I mathed this out and I discovered something that changes notions about the relationship between Evan and A/M, I cannot help but fall into a bit of a gloom given this data. I am a magicphilic individual, I will continue to play mages, but in recent months I also became a huge fan of the Evan and to see my hopes crushed with my own data is difficult to say the least. On the positive front, my I/L isn't as far back compared to F/P as I initially thought. But one thing is clear, with AMs having exponentially better training and similar if not better single-target damage only one conclusion can be drawn...Evans need rebalancing.
Credits: The Attack Speed Reference found here at SP
Russt's calculations and equations taken from a post here